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WL running badly?

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mark87 on Wed Sep 16, 2015 4:07 pm

At least units in the old game respond to commands. Waterloo has them splurge all over the map in different formations; line, column, road column.

It is way more easy managing squares as a divisional commander rather than trying to get 12 battalions (non tced) to follow orders near the enemy.

Also, for me at least, I can't click 60% of the time. I have to click and reclick and reclick. My units die. I just do not have command and control as I did before. Road command on the command map-unusable unless I am right next to my command THEN WHAT IS THE FUCKING POINT OF HAVING IT???????? It's dumb and stupid and the game is broke.

The AI in Waterloo is quite good; everything else sucks. It's too much trouble to click and operate everything. Not worth it for me.

I'd rather play a working game with a few holes than a broken game with a few fixes.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  kg little mac on Wed Sep 16, 2015 5:50 pm

You are the only person who has those problems.

If you played more often, you might figure out how to be an effective commander.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mr. Digby on Wed Sep 16, 2015 6:29 pm

Mark is right, Mark. The WL control issues are something to do with your set-up as the game responds as well to clicking flags as GB did.

The only reasons I am not confident using WL for the campaign right now is we haven't managed to debug the mod and several players haven#'t bought it yet. I hope solving #1 will help solve #2.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:09 pm

In Mark87's defence, I have had exactly the same problem of being unable to click on flags. Not all the time, but it's not just him.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  SJDIII on Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:45 am

I had the same issue with clicking on the flags. I found that getting the mouse pointer closer to the gold pole the flag is waving from solved the issue.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mr. Digby on Thu Sep 17, 2015 9:02 am

Some flags have their 'hotspot' away from the flag. I find that with a few cavalry flags I need to click to the left of the pole and below a little.

Martin - I think we agree that your non-responsive click troubles are caused by something else and not the game (unless the game is causing your entire PC to freak out which is a possibility).

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The other Martin - Charles Reille, le dernier Maréchal de France.

"Any hussar who has not got himself killed by the age of 30 is a jackass." - Antoine Charles Louis Lasalle, commander of Napoleon's light cavalry, killed in battle at Wagram 6 July 1809, aged 34.

"I had forgotten there was an objective." - Generallieutenant Mikhail Borozdin I
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:59 am

Steve – yes that’s a fair point. The hotspot can be a problem, but wasn’t the issue in the game I was referring to. I could click on every flag fine until part way through the game, and then could not click on any. I finally managed to access some units by clicking perhaps a dozen times, but it was obviously not playable.

Diggers – we don’t really know what is causing my problems. It could be:

* internet-related, as my FPS drops sharply in MP. But my internet is fast, and I have a very stable wired connection.

* my PC specs. My graphics card runs hot. But (per the web) it does not run so hot as to be a problem. My PC as a whole is a bit long-in-the-tooth, but was quite powerful when I bought it, and all specs are still *way* above the minimum quoted by Matrix.

* game-related. My Waterloo performance is much worse than in GB, both in SP and MP. Yet the minimum specs quoted for Waterloo are the same as those for GB. Like Mark, I have never experienced the flag-clicking issue in GB.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Uncle Billy on Thu Sep 17, 2015 2:38 pm

The AI calculations are longer and therefore more cpu intensive than in the previous game. That may explain some drop in fps over the previous game. Martin's case is an extreme one. I can't help but think it is due to the graphic card's high temperature. Even at idle speed it is very high. If it's not temperature related, then there is something about the gpu architecture or software that is incompatible with the new game.

The inability to click on the flags in Martin's case I think is due to the extremely low fps. The click command gets stuck into a queue that is moving extremely slow. Although the flag is being clicked on several times, it is the actual first click that gets executed a second or two after it occurs. Later on, the others get executed. Of course by then, several other flags have probably been clicked, hair has been pulled out and a strong drink is required to right things. In other words, a nightmare scenario. affraid

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Charmead on Thu Sep 17, 2015 2:45 pm

Bourbon works. A good scotch. Or as Digby will resonate with from the campaign scenario, a horribly crappy wine from a personal vineyard.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Thu Sep 17, 2015 4:17 pm

The graphics card is certainly top of the list for further testing (along with bourbon, scotch and wine).  

Have tried pushing the fan speed up to 100%, and that drives the temperature down several degrees, but doesn't appear to increase FPS.  Am now going to try a stock scenario with fan at 100% and the PC case open to see if I can really drive the temperature down.  

I have a AMD Radeon HD 5670.  Does anyone else use this, and have they had any problem?

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mark87 on Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:44 pm

I have an AMD card as well: I will post my specs when I get home. The game is fine when I start playing but after a little while it becomes harder to click. In combat I can't click at all sometimes.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Thu Sep 17, 2015 7:24 pm

That's interesting, Mark. It was as soon as combat started that my own clicking problems began.

I should say though, that this has only happened once, although I have experienced a range of different problems in other games, such as being unable to use free text in courier messages, or being unable to send a message when composed.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mark87 on Thu Sep 17, 2015 7:34 pm

Martin,

The game doesn't seem stable to me; even the vanilla game doesn't respond as quickly. I have a really good PC and I run a ton of top of the line games, so I am unsure as to the problem. Perhaps me posting the specs shall aid in the determination?
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:10 pm

If you wouldn't mind, Mark. I think that's a good idea. I'm not knowledgeable enough, but it might give some ideas to Kevin and others.

It's interesting that you're having similar problems with a high-end machine. I recall some similar comments from folks on the NSD forum shortly after the game came out. They couldn't understand why they weren't getting better performance with top-end PCs.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Uncle Billy on Thu Sep 17, 2015 9:41 pm

The likely reason high end machines are getting poor results is due to poorly implemented multi-threading. A programmer cannot just throw two processes onto two different cores and expect to get twice the processing. If one thread finishes much earlier than the other, the core will not wait overly long before it dumps it's results onto the stack and goes off and does something else. CPUs have short attention spans. When the other process has finished and tells the other core it's ready for the results, that core must load up all the information again. In cpu terms that takes a long time. In fact it could take more time than if the whole program was run on one core. That's why MP runs much faster on my machine than SP. MP is single threaded. I suspect all high end machine see this effect.

I did a test a while ago to see if this was really the case. I created a small scenario and ran it on Gburg, (single threaded game), and WL. On Gburg I had 400fps, (yes I almost always get over 100fps in that game), on WL it was 36fps. Typically an SP WL game will run in the high teens or low 20s on my machine. Now the AI is improved in the new game, but not to the tune of an order of magnitude. As if it's needed, this is just another example of the game being rushed to the market without proper testing. I wonder if very much testing was done at all.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  SJDIII on Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:38 pm

I did notice a 25% improvement in FPS by changing the following options on page 2

Max Terrain Draw Distance: Best to High
Show Map Objects: Best to High
Uniform Quality: Best to High

Alas an improvement from 3 FPS to 4 FPS seems dubious. Crying or Very sad
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mark87 on Fri Sep 18, 2015 3:11 pm

Even single player lags and has issues for me. Gettysburg, I turn max settings on and play with a couple mods that allow extra troop sprites and I have literally zero lag. Waterloo the first scenario lags so much I haven't ever played single player waterloo. I dunno, just isn't fun. Choppy and doesn't seem to work. I am not imagining these issues. If I could return the game I would in a heartbeat trust me.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Iberalc on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:20 am

Mine is a AMD Radeon HD 5700.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:51 am

Thanks Pepe.  I take it you're happy with performance?

I looked at a site which compares models and produces an "smart rating".  Although there appear to be several differences between the models, the overall smart ratings are almost identical.  Yours wins by 74 to 73 Embarassed

http://graphics-cards.specout.com/compare/54-73/ATI-HD-5700-vs-ATI-Radeon-HD-5670

There are a few comments by users saying the card (mine) runs quite hot.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mark87 on Sun Sep 20, 2015 1:28 am

-----------------
System Information
------------------
Time of this report: 9/19/2015, 20:26:13
Machine name: MARKANTHONY-PC
Operating System: Windows 7 Professional 64-bit (6.1, Build 7601) Service Pack 1 (7601.win7sp1_gdr.150715-0600)
Language: English (Regional Setting: English)
System Manufacturer: To Be Filled By O.E.M.
System Model: To Be Filled By O.E.M.
BIOS: BIOS Date: 12/06/13 00:14:37 Ver: 04.06.05
Processor: AMD FX(tm)-8350 Eight-Core Processor (8 CPUs), ~4.0GHz
Memory: 16384MB RAM
Available OS Memory: 16340MB RAM
Page File: 3955MB used, 28723MB available
Windows Dir: C:\Windows
DirectX Version: DirectX 11
DX Setup Parameters: Not found
User DPI Setting: Using System DPI
System DPI Setting: 96 DPI (100 percent)
DWM DPI Scaling: Disabled
DxDiag Version: 6.01.7601.17514 32bit Unicode

------------
DxDiag Notes
------------
Display Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 1: No problems found.
Sound Tab 2: No problems found.
Input Tab: No problems found.

--------------------
DirectX Debug Levels
--------------------
Direct3D: 0/4 (retail)
DirectDraw: 0/4 (retail)
DirectInput: 0/5 (retail)
DirectMusic: 0/5 (retail)
DirectPlay: 0/9 (retail)
DirectSound: 0/5 (retail)
DirectShow: 0/6 (retail)

---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: AMD Radeon R9 200 Series
Manufacturer: Advanced Micro Devices, Inc.
Chip type: AMD Radeon Graphics Processor (0x6798)
DAC type: Internal DAC(400MHz)
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_1002&DEV_6798&SUBSYS_30011787&REV_00
Display Memory: 4095 MB
Dedicated Memory: 3051 MB
Shared Memory: 1044 MB
Current Mode: 1600 x 900 (32 bit) (60Hz)
Monitor Name: HP W2071d LED Backlit Monitor
Monitor Model: HP W2071d
Monitor Id: HWP299C
Native Mode: 1600 x 900(p) (60.000Hz)
Output Type: DVI
Driver Name: aticfx64.dll,aticfx64.dll,aticfx64.dll,aticfx32,aticfx32,aticfx32,atiumd64.dll,atidxx64.dll,atidxx64.dll,atiumdag,atidxx32,atidxx32,atiumdva,atiumd6a.cap,atitmm64.dll
Driver File Version: 8.17.0010.1333 (English)
Driver Version: 14.501.1003.0
DDI Version: 11
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Martin on Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:46 am

Thanks Mark. That looks pretty impressive - certainly compared to my geriatric set-up.

It's surprising that you are having issues.

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Re: WL running badly?

Post  SJDIII on Sun Sep 20, 2015 1:13 pm

He has the hardware horse power , even better the me.

I hate these problems. It's such a pain in the ass to track down.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Charmead on Sun Sep 20, 2015 1:36 pm

You had me at 16GBytes
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WL running badly?

Post  Mark87 on Sun Sep 20, 2015 3:42 pm

I don't know what any of that means honestly. My neighbor built my computer. I just know the game should run well and it runs poorly; very poorly.
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Re: WL running badly?

Post  Mr. Digby on Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:17 pm

All - I split this topic off from the Peninsular Campaign tech discussion thread where it was.

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"I had forgotten there was an objective." - Generallieutenant Mikhail Borozdin I
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